The Tory Party At Its Howling Worst

Jerry, while I very much enjoy your articles, I must take you to task here, I feel you have missed the essential point

The government created e-petitions to allow us to influence policy by making a subject eligible for debate in the House of Commons

That same government is now ordering its MPs (the ones we elect to represent us) to ignore that subject

This is wrong on so many levels

When i was a youngster learning at my local secondary school. I was taught we live in a Democracy. A Democracy that had been protected at a cost of millions of lives.
I was also taught we elected a representative to Parliament, this was our local MP. Whose task was to make the views of his/her constituents known to the Government.
What happened to that?
The vast majority of Britain's citizens want a referendum on continued membership of the EU.
The fact previously so called Eurosceptic politicians are now scuttling round doing all they can to prevent a referendum. Shows them for what they are, liars.
They are contemptuous of the voters, they follow their own career path and are desperately hoping for a future job in the EU, with it's attached huge salary and huger expense account.
As for you Mr Hayes. You show yourself to be totally out of touch with the electorate. We're lucky you are now out of politics.

But Jerry - its a *non-binding* vote. I don't think there is nothing wrong in voting for the principle of having a referendum. Having a three line whip has transformed this from being a minor storm in a tea cup to something blown out of all proportion. I'm afraid its Cameron's piss poor party management that is to blame. If I were an MP I'd vote for it, and I regard myself as a practical Eurosceptic, not a Euro head banger.

I think Jerry is totally wrong on this.

At a time of great financial crisis it is right that parliament discuss a motion on the EU .
The motion will lead to no action and is completely non binding - As Voice from the South West says.

Which basically shows that Parliament has not lost its ability to discuss the irrelevant and unimportant at a time of great crisis .. thus showing the similar irrelevance of most MPs and the institution.

After all, the Germans and their courts lay down strict rules on what the German Government can or cannot do in terms of baling out other sovereign nations. We have no such constraints.

Given the above, it is clear UK democracy is largely out of touch with the issues of the day and we should leave the EU as our democratic freedoms are far less than other members. Obviously the anti EU MPs don't want us as a country to have any constitutional safeguards on Government spending.

I assume that's why the Outs want to leave the EU?

Glad to see that the entire Tory party isn't frothing. Anyway the idea of a referendum with an option 're-negotiate' is plain childish. What? How? With what end?
Without that option of course the vote would go 'yes, stay in'. I don't think we should say that either. This is not the time to ask, let alone negotiate, the stage is shifting dramatically.

Hattori. The government created e pets so that policy can be debated. It has never been govt policy that we have a referendum on leaving the EU, only if there is a new treaty that could take powers away from the EU. Therefore it is right that MPs are whipped in favour of policy. EU matters have never in recent years been a matter of conscience. Thanks for your kind words though.
Daggs: No. MPs are elected to represent their constituencies not slavishly follow every letter and email. They are elected to use their judgements. That has been the modern definition of democracy.
From the South:*non binding vote* is just the thin end of the wedge. They could call another binding one.
Madasafish:actually I agree with you that is why I think that the vote on a referendum is a distraction.Let them debate how we can improve the EU institutions and make them more efficient , more accountable and less bureaucratic.
contravariantnt. I entirely agree

The addition of a third option and Cameron's imposition of a three-line whip against democracy both seem profoundly stupid; considering this referendum was a Lib Dem manifesto commitment, it would be much easier to justify both parties having a three line whip FOR a two-option referendum as promised.

Even if we concede for the moment Cameron's excuse that the current economic mess means we shouldn't consider changes right now, why not schedule it for later? 2013, or "within this Parliament", for example.

This fiasco is exactly why I felt from the outset that the e-petitions weren't going far enough: reaching the 100,000 mark should mean the issue is put to a referendum directly, without Parliamentary interference, like they do in real democracies from California to Switzerland. Anything less is a scam - as Cameron just demonstrated to us.

I am a Labour Party member, and support a referendum.

To simply describe it as a Tory issue is wrong.

Many Labour voters would like our relationship with the EU to be different than it is.

I think that by Dave, Ed and Nick taking the line they have, it shows how out of touch they are.

It seem to me that this e-petitions malarkey is a travesty

It's a travesty of a mockery of a sham of a mockery of a travesty of two mockeries of a sham

A wonderful and totally accurate description of the mad as a snake Tory right. Thanks Jerry.

I don't know why Cameron is bothering with a three-line whip: a horsewhip would be more effective in treating the Fruit and Nuttalls.

I really struggle to understand the religious fervour of the Tory Euroloons, perhaps they have such stunted sex lives that leaving the EU would be their Second Coming.

At a time of global financial peril this is an irrelevant and damaging sideshow.

There is a lot of loose talk about repatriation of powers, but which ones are they talking about? The Social Chapter? That might please the Libertarian fringe. I'm sure that Vince Cable would be delighted as Sec. of State for BIS to lighten the regulatory burden on businesses, but I'm equally sure that he has no desire to send nine year olds up chimneys, either. So the Social Chapter stays.

A wholesale rejection of employment rights is not going to create any worthwhile jobs. I thought the emphasis of this current government in reforming welfare (stick), whilst lifting the threshold for income tax (carrot) was right. In time it will surely lead to an increase in employment. The government might also look at raising the threshold for employer's National Insurance contributions.

I could instantly think of a dozen ways to improve the way that the EU works. A single seat for the Parliament, just for a start. Everyone else with a passing interest in current affairs could think of a remarkably similar list. So I would be very happy to see the government press for those - and any repatriations that the three main parties can agree on. Not at the moment, though, as it is urgent for the EU to address the Eurozone debt crisis. Later, thus.

And I do hope that Cameron applies the horsewhip with gusto.